Is it necessary to protect the sulfuric acid sampling point from rain?
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Our three acid tanks for drying, absorption, and final product processing, along with all the pipes and valves, are all located outdoors. The sampling tanks for these three acid tanks resemble small pots with lids; when sampling, the lid is removed and samples are taken manually using a sampling container. The liquid inside these pots is concentrated sulfuric acid. It rains often in our area, and I’m worried that rainwater might leak into the sampling tanks during rainy days. However, the designer insisted that he has designed dozens of such systems that are also outdoors, and that no accidents have ever occurred due to rainwater entering the sampling tanks. So I would like to ask how the sampling tanks are constructed here – are any measures taken to prevent rainwater from getting in? Am I overthinking it, or was the design inadequate?
Sampling troughs, sampling cylinders, as well as small pots and pot lids – professional terminology should be used. Sampling must be carried out from acid pipelines; the amount taken is small, but protective measures are necessary to avoid waste and contamination!
:Lol, as long as one can understand it, why go to such lengths to be professional?
Typical sampling analysis involves taking samples using specialized sampling tubes； Sampling from the finished product storage tank can be done from the upper part of the tank. However, the person in charge should pay attention to whether the so-called \"lid\" is somewhat special – its uniqueness lies in the fact that it has a lower edge; after sampling, covering this lid over the sampling port will effectively seal it, preventing rainwater from getting in. If it has a flat cover, it needs to be improved. Some are even wrapped in sand. Anything can go wrong; the key is whether one is careful. Making simple problems more complicated is not always a good thing.
Generally, sampling involves specialized equipment, locations, procedures, and personnel; therefore, every measure we can think of is already in place!
The shape doesn’t matter; what’s most important is that it be practical. It can be a “pot” or a “tray” – it doesn’t make a difference. I suggest you conduct a test in rainy weather: pour a bucket of water from above the sampling point to see how it works.
It definitely won’t leak in when no one is taking samples, but if it rains heavily, there will be water on the lid of the pot; if one isn’t careful when lifting the lid to take a sample, water can leak in. Well, it’s hard to explain clearly; I’ll take a photo and upload it tomorrow
It seems that the designers are all empiricists, believing that their own experience is correct; the original poster should give careful consideration to these issues
The response from our senior designers, who are experienced engineers with years of experience working with sulfuric acid, was as follows: “Why do you need to take samples when it’s raining? You can just do it when it’s not raining.” I said that in our area, it never stops raining for more than three days at a time; how is it possible to avoid that? He replied, “If you still insist on taking samples during rainy days, then there’s a problem with your production management – you might even deserve to be fired.” This was indeed said during a formal meeting, without any exaggeration; I didn’t even have the energy to get angry.
Previously, in our factory, the pipes that were used to direct liquid into the drain pipes would corrode easily, causing acid leaks; now that we’ve installed a small cap on them, things have improved quite a bit. Also, sometimes the analysts fail to close the valves properly after taking samples, or the valves cannot be closed fully, which makes leaks most likely to occur.
It seems Comrade Jondger is in Guizhou; he accidentally revealed his identity. Please search for the keyword “sampling bucket”; I once posted a thread on this topic. Please click the following link: http://bbs.hcbbs.com/viewthread.php?tid=61207&highlight=%C8%A1%D1%F9 This post was last edited by in the blink of an eye on 2009-4-8 13:54 ]
There is a rain shelter over our sampling point; it’s quite simple and meant only to facilitate sampling, not for safety reasons
Ugh~~ I’m just so angry. I have no idea what the people in charge of the project are thinking. Sampling points are only meant to be representative; there are tens of thousands of control valves and instruments at the site, and we asked them to install rain covers on them, but their answer was always: no money, no need for it. How can one afford to buy such expensive items? As for whether it’s necessary or not, it’s true that we chose an outdoor-type model, but the control valves without protective covers in other workshops stopped working after just two years. The workshop technicians, when in a good mood, installed protective covers on those valves, and they’ve been working fine for over three years now (it’s not just one or two valves; it’s an entire set of systems, with dozens of valves both with and without such covers, which is enough to illustrate the point). I don’t understand why it’s so difficult to convince them that spending 200 yuan can extend the lifespan of a valve worth 200,000 yuan by one year (and based on what we’ve seen, the actual increase should be even greater). Also, last time we asked them to install security windows on the second and third floors as well; they said it wasn’t necessary. As a result, three computers in the workshop were stolen, yet they still refused to install the windows. . . . I’ll have to install it myself in the future. An investment of 300 million really dissapoints me. . .
The most ridiculous thing is that variable-frequency cooling fans are not provided where they’re needed; instead, imported Fisher control valves, imported guide vanes, a motor with variable frequency control, and a cooler bypass system are used (the control valve is also from Fisher). Every time I see this setup, I can’t help but laugh. It’s a shame there’s no hydraulic coupling – otherwise it would be complete~
You suggest adding another hydraulic coupling; then we can apply for a world record :lol
I think a shed should be added; otherwise, water droplets will enter the sampling bottle during sampling, and the acid concentration will then be inaccurate
Design and production needs are often out of sync. Some things can only be technically modified in actual production based on the specific circumstances; you can’t expect those guys who sit in offices and follow blueprints claiming to be designers to listen to you.
It is recommended to consider converting the SO3 cooler into a boiler once the installation is operating stably, in order to recover steam for the desorption of the amine solution.
Weren’t your boilers rejected? If it is used for stripping in the regenerated amine unit, but the steam generation volume is unstable and does not meet the requirements, then it is considered a useless asset; I guess you reached this conclusion even without using a boiler as well. You do have a bit too many cooling fans installed. Generally, the simpler the operation, the better, and you’ve made things quite complicated. The two control valves are also acceptable, though a bit more advanced. I still need to ask: if there is variable frequency, what is the purpose of guide vanes? How do you proceed when operating? Isn’t it quite troublesome? And where else refuses to install variable frequency drives no matter what? Is it an SO2 fan? Is that necessary? Wouldn’t a guide vane solve the problem?
That’s the situation in design institutes these days; actually, private companies don’t need to go through such hassle. Please ask some experts to make an overall plan; the specific equipment and processes will be provided by the manufacturer during the design phase. Everyone knows perfectly well how to save money in practical ways, just like it’s written in a mirror!
The pump that requires variable frequency control is the circulating acid pump. Due to operational requirements, the output of this pump is about 20% higher than the rated flow rate of the acid cooler. Without variable frequency control, it is necessary to use valves to maintain pressure; this not only increases the risk associated with high pipeline pressures, but also results in unnecessary energy waste. Moreover, variable frequency control provides greater safety during startup and pump switching. In fact, the cost of low-voltage variable frequency technology is minimal. I would really like the SO2 fan to have variable frequency control, but it’s okay without it; it just wastes electricity (operating at 30-50% load for extended periods). We have control valves (without vanes), as well as a hydraulic coupling, which is basically sufficient. For the guide vanes of the SO2 cooling fan, I plan to treat them as if they didn’t exist; priority will be given to frequency control, and if that’s not sufficient, control valves will be used. If even that doesn’t work, a bypass can be activated (though it’s likely unnecessary – if those two methods don’t work either, then the cooling fan can simply be turned off).